4chan archive /fit/ (index)
2013-05-17 06:23 20004925 Sleep Science Guy Sleep Health General (aThJc.jpg 640x426 98kB)
Hi /fit/, I am doing a sleep health general. Any questions about sleep health/hygeine, science, lucid dreaming, or anything sleep related just go. If anyone can contriboot would be good too.

3 min later 20004977 Anonymous
Why do humans need to sleep? Inb4 'they're tired'.

5 min later 20005004 Anonymous
How bad does snoring fuck up your sleep? Any tips on snore prevention?

5 min later 20005008 Anonymous
>>20004925 Why am I always tired?

5 min later 20005014 Anonymous (Screen Shot 2013-03-20 at 5.57.09 PM.png 384x344 149kB)
>>20004925 isnt sleep just a process used to "check in" with the interdimensional overlords and provide subliminal data on this universe? That's why if you don't do it you die, they just summon it from you. Likewise you go crazy without much sleep because you havent received the necessary out of dimension time to function on this plane? thats what i was taught at school

6 min later 20005027 Anonymous
I sleep 6h per night. I feel very rested the next morning and not especially tired when I go to sleep. Will such a schedule fuck me up in the long run?

7 min later 20005042 Anonymous
i am seriously depressed. im able to function but i can't sleep at night. what can i do to get back on track? i'd prefer to avoid supplements if possible

8 min later 20005049 Anonymous (247266_1244233202209_full.jpg 210x210 20kB)

8 min later 20005056 Anonymous
>>20004977 energy conservation, regulation of hormones, recovery and repair and various structures, restoration of body homeostasis >>20005004 snoring itself isn't an issue but it could be a sign of sleep apnea. this is especially important if you are fat. get yourself monitored overnight and you will know for sure. >>20005008 misalignment of circadian rhythm (going to bed / waking up at different times every day) leading to poor sleep quality. there are a billion other factors that could be hurting the quality of your sleep but that is the biggest one.

9 min later 20005074 Sleep Science Guy
>>20004977 It's because functions of memory consolidation can only occur when we are not making new memories, thus we can't be awake. We also need to slow the brain down so that it can stock up on antioxidants and energy stores because while we are awake we use up more energy than we restock and make more waste than we can clear. Thirdly, we release hormones while we sleep, and without sleep we don't get these vital hormone secretions... >>20005004 Snoring indicates restricted airflow and reduces oxygen intake. This causes the heart to beat faster, increases blood pressure and prevents the low-frequency stages of sleep. Basically, it fucks up your sleep. First stop sleeping on your back, sleep on your belly with your head to the side. If you can't because you are overweight and it is comfortable, then lose weight until you can. If it is because of neck inflexibility, then go see a physio and do neck/shoulder stretches daily too.

10 min later 20005086 Anonymous
Why do i feel more tired initially after getting 12 hours of sleep then when i only get 4 hours? What is the correlation between marijuana and sleep?

10 min later 20005094 Anonymous
How bad is sleeping for 2 hours, driving a bit, and going back to sleep for 5 more hours for my body?

11 min later 20005107 Anonymous
I have very vivid dreams regularly (3+ days/week) and lucid dream about once a week, not intentionally. What causes some people to have vivid dreams they remember? What lets some people lucid dream?

11 min later 20005114 Anonymous
>>20005074 I sleep on belly and still snore. Will I die?

12 min later 20005121 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005008 not enough information. i don't know how much you sleep, how you sleep, what your sleep environment is, how you eat/exercise or if you are on any medications or have a history of disease, etc. >>20005027 Total sleep time doesn't matter, instead the amount of SWS and REM matters, if you are getting sufficient SWS and REM sleep within that 6h block then you will be fine.

12 min later 20005135 Anonymous
>>20005014 Dude...

14 min later 20005166 Anonymous
>>20005121 How do I know if I get enough of them? Not being tired is a good sign I would guess? Also, why do we feel tired as fuck when we oversleep. If I sleep sometimes 10+ hours on weekend, I feel like shit when waking up.

14 min later 20005172 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005042 improve your sleep hygeine. read up on http://www.polyphasicsociety.com/po lyphasic-sleep/adaptation/night-lig hting/ so that your circadian rhythm isn't being mucked up by blue/green light at night time.

16 min later 20005189 Anonymous
hi ssg, do you frequent here? second time i've seen you now

18 min later 20005235 Anonymous
>>20005121 Always tired guy here. I tend to sleep 6 to 9 hours a night, but I average 7.5 to 8 most night. I tend to sleep all the way through the night unless something's wrong or I'm woken up by something. My sleep environment is pretty quiet, my bed isn't very old and I rotate my mattress often. I eat a mostly balanced diet; I've been on a cut for a while, but that really didn't affect anything that I could think of. No medications, no history of any major diseases. I used to be fatasfatass.

18 min later 20005238 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005086 marijuana fucks up sleep, it reduces REM sleep and reduces the function of SWS. You feel tired after 12h sleep because too much REM sleep can lead to a type of dopaminergic exhaustion. You aren't actually tired, as soon as the sleep inertia wares off you would perform well. >>20005107 usually it's because of higher brain-choline levels which make dreams more vivid. lucid dreams occur because connections from the front of the brain which normally shut off during sleep stay connected. It is not bad.

19 min later 20005245 Centipede
I know you said in the last thread I saw you in you shouldn't eat before bed,but what about a whey protein shake? Since it digests quicker than regular food, and has L-arginine you'd think it would be beneficial to hgh production during sleep

19 min later 20005251 Anonymous
if i get up to pee after sleeping for 6 hours and then sleep like 2 hours more would my gains be in jepardy? also i can't fall asleep for like half an hour after i'd get up to pee

20 min later 20005266 Anonymous
>>20005086 Not sleep science guy, but sleeping more than eight or nine hours can leave you feeling more tired than when you went to sleep. Strange but true.

21 min later 20005297 Anonymous
>>20005245 in the last thread he said it would be okay to have a protein shake before bed

21 min later 20005300 Anonymous
>>20005086 I know sleep is one of those things that you have to do in moderation, too much is bad and so is too little. On the other hand, 4 hours seems somewhat low, maybe your circadian rhythm is shorter? As for marijuana, I think it decreases your slow wave sleep, I don't think it has much of an effect on REM, and it reduces your Sleep Onset Latency (or time it takes to get to sleep). Basically, it's kind of like alcohol in that you feel you're getting a great sleep, but if you have a normal circadian rhythm you're not. It only helps if say you get too much slow wave sleep, then marijuana helps offset that.

22 min later 20005307 Centipede
>>20005238 So is it bad health wise to get too much REM sleep and have this dopaminergic exhaustion? Or would more REM just mean more hormone secretions, energy, and memory consolidation?

23 min later 20005320 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005189 I will pop by a couple of times a week. Have been here for a few years now, never made a trip. >>20005235 what time do you go to bed? do you leave any tv/computer/lights on in your bedroom? could you be at risk of a vitamin d deficiency? how warm is your sleeping environment?

23 min later 20005321 Anonymous
it's taking me too long to get back to sleep after waking up in the middle of the night ( -_-)

24 min later 20005334 Anonymous
Its people like trip4cut and Sleep Science Guy that make this board worth visiting. My question is this. I have a younger guy that I help out at my gym who is 16. Gets about 6-7 hours of a sleep. He tells me he falls asleep during the day sometimes in class. Is this a sign of something?

25 min later 20005346 Anonymous
Does it really matter WHEN i sleep? Like if I sleep from 4am to 1pm or from 10pm to 7 am?

26 min later 20005361 Anonymous
Why do some people need a tv on for them to sleep better?

27 min later 20005371 Anonymous
Sometimes before falling asleep, i think of impossibly ridiculous thoughts and i can swear i'm conscious at the time but after going over it cause of how ridiculous they actually are i assume i almost fell asleep but didn't. how can i prevent this bs from happening? It bugs the ass off of me.

28 min later 20005388 Anonymous
>>20005334 Sleep apnea. Narcolepsy. Does he snore a lot? Is he overweight?

28 min later 20005391 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005245 Protein isolate should be fine, it will clear the stomach in about 20 minutes, usually. >>20005251 That is fine. Many, many people do this. I personally get up after 3-4.5h to pee. >>20005300 it actually decreases REM and increases slow wave sleep, but as i said above, it reduces the restorative function of slow wave sleep. >>20005307 Too much REM can lead to depression. On average people get 1.5-2.5h REM per night, and even 3h REM is fine, but getting far above that can be bad for your health. REM is important because it does consolidate memory, it also is when the body releases testosterone for the day, this is why natural test is highest in the morning. and lowest at night. More REM is going to better until you hit that 3h+ mark. Ideally most people should aim to increase their SWS, and not their REM. Many people get lots of REM but not enough SWS and thus feel tired in the mornings.

29 min later 20005394 Centipede
>>20005297 Okay, well I have a second part to the question actually, I have heard people say taking casein protein before bed is beneficial, not sure if legit or just a rumor and would be the opposite, as I know you say you sleep deeper on an empty stomach

29 min later 20005400 Anonymous
>>20005235 Around 2 AM most nights. My room does get a little bit warm after a while, but not stiflingly hot. I don't leave any electronics on in my bedroom at night. I doubt I would have Vitamin D deficiency, I'm in the sun all the time and I take a multivitamin. There's one thing I didn't think about, though. I just finished a very stressful semester of school last week and I'm wondering if that might have something to do with it. I made Dean's List, though.

29 min later 20005401 Anonymous
not trying to jack your thread SSG, i studied this at uni so i'm answering some questions. i hope you don't mind :3 >>20005094 nothing wrong with it, just don't make it a habit >>20005114 the affects of sleep apnea are more of a chronic issue (i.e. you probably aren't going to die in your sleep tonight just because you snore). you should get yourself tested. >>20005166 if you are compensating on weekends (sleeping far more than usual) then you aren't getting enough sleep during the week. SSG answered your other question above. >>20005245 nothing wrong with eating a small meal before bed, in fact eating some protein before bed is a good idea to assist recovery. >>20005251 waking up briefly isn't an issue, but you should fall asleep again faster than that. try to limit your exposure to bright lights while you pee. >>20005307 too much of anything is bad >>20005321 this is a common ailment that has a million potential causes >>20005334 falling asleep during the day = not getting enough sleep at night, period >>20005346 no, but you should sleep at the same time every night to establish a good circadian rhythm >>20005361 white noise >>20005371 your mind is just wandering, don't worry about it

31 min later 20005416 Anonymous
>>20005172 I have this app installed on my computer.. Am I just fooling myself into thinking it does something? http://stereopsis.com/flux/

32 min later 20005433 Centipede
>>20005391 So how would you go about increasing SWS?

32 min later 20005435 Anonymous

33 min later 20005439 asianman
>>20005346 not really. just as long as you get the amount of hours to rest

34 min later 20005459 Anonymous
>>20005388 No snoring, not overweight. I'd have to ask him more about his health to better understand though. >>20005401 This is probably it, but it sometimes occurs when he gets 8+ hours of sleep. Is that theory where lost sleep catches up to true?

34 min later 20005462 Anonymous
>>20004925 am i missing something in your pic OP?

35 min later 20005474 Anonymous (1360532240452.jpg 400x596 28kB)
>>20005014 lol'd heartily almost spilled my creatine on cat

36 min later 20005482 Anonymous
optimal amount of sleep for gainz? Least amount of sleep for gainz?

36 min later 20005486 Anonymous
>>20004925 Is that a fucking thinkpad? Why are the 10keys on the right? What the fuck is with that gui, why is it so red?

36 min later 20005497 Centipede
Kind of sleep related; What do you know about binaural beats? I see them all over youtube, saying certain frequencies will help you sleep deeper, have lucid dreams, and even increase hgh production. I listen to them every now and then when I'm going to bed just for the hell of it, but I have no idea if it's actually working. I've listened to other ones when meditating, and they seem to work, but I'm not sure if they're just placebo

36 min later 20005502 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005321 Stop stressing about getting back to sleep. Many people will keep themselves up because they think about how important it is they get back to sleep as soon as possible, or toss and turn etc. If you struggle getting back to sleep in the mornings do two things: - firstly, make sure you aren't turning on any lights when you go to the bathroom! take a piss in the dark, otherwise you will disrupt your melatonin secretions by turning the lights on. - secondly go and relax, do some meditaiton or reading by candlelight, if you are hungry have a small low carb snack, pet the cat/dog, etc, then go back to bed. >>20005334 Falling asleep in the day, once, is natural, if he isn't drinking caffeine. The circadian rhythm dictates 3 major core body temperature dips: soon after dusk, around dawn, and after midday. You are meant to be asleep during these hours, a siesta is perfectly natural. If he is falling asleep 3-4 times a day he is probably not getting enough sleep at night. >>20005361 Ambient noise, or perhaps entrainment from a young age. TVs are actually disruptive of sleep, these people would be better to have small fan running next to them at night, so they have something to listen to but no light shining on them. If they need light, get a red LED because red spectrum light doesn't disrupt sleep (white, blue and green do). >>20005346 Yes, there is a phenomena such as long and short days. People living in a climate with short days have poorer quality sleep and higher risk of many diseases. If you stay up at night you are basically shortening your night. If you want to waste less time sleeping at night you are better to either get up earlier, or spend a few hours in the middle of the night doing stuff by candlelight/redLEDlight. Going to bed early is important. There is no such thing as early birds and night owls, this is a hypothesis with no proof.

37 min later 20005508 Anonymous
Does lucid dreaming have any effects on your sleep at all? I know that the brain and your body do a lot of things while you're sleeping. Would lucid dreaming make it so they half-ass everything?

39 min later 20005532 Anonymous
Best supplements for lucid dreaming?

40 min later 20005545 Anonymous
God bless you Sleep Science Guy

41 min later 20005552 Anonymous
It's 1AM for me, should I go to sleep, or stay up and learn more awesome things about this thread about sleep.

44 min later 20005610 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005400 stress can drain vitamin d, multis don't contain it, and some people can still have d deficiency if they get sun. 2am is too late, you may be getting poor quality sleep. earlier sleep = better sleep. colder sleep is better too. >>20005433 different things work for different people. I will just go through the common ones. Some see improvements by supplementing melatonin at night or vitamin d, obviously curing a deficiency. Others will see an improvement by losing weight. Others will see an improvement by following a ketogenic diet (lower blood sugar = more SWS). Others will get more by lowering their room temperature or sleeping with less blankets. Iodine+retinol can work for others as it increases thyroid function. Exercising 4-5h before you sleep increases SWS in most people. >>20005462 >>20005486 yes, you are seeing my laptop with a rubylith cover over the top of the screen. This stops the screen from emitting blue/green spectrum light, and lets me go on my computer at night without disrupting my sleeping pattern. >>20005482 Maximize SWS and REM sleep, up to about 3h of each and you will get maximum gains.

45 min later 20005622 Anonymous
>>20004925 Know anything about http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Delaye d_sleep_phase_disorder ? I've been diagnosed with it but haven't been able to get back to the doctor. It doesn't seem like there's any real treatment or respect for it ;~; Got any good news?

47 min later 20005644 Anonymous
What do you know about sleepy paralysis? I CAN NOT sleep on my stomach because whenever I do I'm sure to get sleep paralysis

47 min later 20005657 Anonymous (598379_10151151855686314_2130026629_n.jpg 960x960 273kB)
Why do I never get tired to the point where I want to go to bed? I have to force myself to go to bed, then I usually can go to sleep fairly quickly though.

50 min later 20005692 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005497 binaural beats can be used to improve sleep quality, that is another way you can increase SWS! I forgot about it hehe. I am not sure about the youtube ones, they may be of too low quality to effect your brain. But basically if you run a delta beat while you are sleeping you will get more delta wave sleep. pretty cool stuff! >>20005508 no evidence for lucid dreaming being good or bad for you. I have read one crappy study that showed subjective feeling of rest, and most people said a lucid dream rested them more. it was probably just the REM-dopamine talking :) >>20005532 citicoline is good, so is huperzine and maybe piracetam/oxi. drinking some hot choc milk in the night can increase insulin and glucose shuttle to the brain increasing REm.. and you might like to play around with hallucinogenics if you have access to them. lastly, curing deficiencies helps a lot, like magnesium/calcium, zinc, b6, b12 etc. you don't need supplements for these if oyu eat right, of course! meditation is great practice for lucid dreaming too, for things like WILD or FILD etc. >>20005552 you could archive it and read it later.

52 min later 20005727 Anonymous
>>20005657 I should add this happens even when I'm not on my laptop/gaming

52 min later 20005733 Anonymous
>>20005692 sorry i posted in all caps sleep guy just please. i can't sleep anymore I've been awake for days. I feel like shit i lay down at night in complete darkness and cant sleep. i'm out of melatonin til i get paid. and even then it makes me sleep but i dont feel any better... please ;_;

53 min later 20005739 Anonymous
Got a question. My wife takes melatonin before bed and someone told her that if you take it for a prolonged time that your brain will stop producing it. How true is this?

57 min later 20005794 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005622 While there ARE severe cases where controlled environment doesn't help, but most people with DSPD simply have poor sleep hygiene. I suggest buying a 5m or 10m strip of 5050 LEDs and plugging them into an electrical timer. Set the timer so that the LEDs turn on 30 minutes before your selected time to get out of bed. This will mean you have an artificial LED sunrise, basically. Secondly get your doc to prescribe you melatonin, or get it OTC if in america. take 0.5mg melatonin with your dinner, and take 1mg 10 minutes before you go to bed. the light therapy combined with the melatonin at night usually fixes people right up. >>20005657 poor lighting conditions. too much light on in your house and you won't get sleepy. >>20005644 that is strange because most people get sleep paralysis when they are on their backs.

58 min later 20005803 Anonymous
>>20005692 Wait, so you're supposed to listen to binaural beats while you sleep, not before?

58 min later 20005813 Anonymous
Why can't I sleep properly when I lift heavy? For example yesterday morning was leg day and I couldn't sleep more than 5 hours last night. WTF? I'm supposed to sleep more since my muscles need to recover and I'm exhausted.

59 min later 20005830 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005739 it's not true. look up actual studies, exogenous melatonin doesn't effect endogenous melatonin secretions.

1 hours later 20005839 Anonymous
How can I stop myself from just staying up at night on the internet? I know it's not great for me, but it happens all the time (right now 1:22 AM).

1 hours later 20005844 Anonymous
>>20005794 Yeah I was looking into building a light fixture. I tried melatonin but it only worked for about a year or two, and I take it sparingly now, which is a few years after. I tired 3mg, 5mg and 10mg towards the end but nothing worked. I would avoid screens and try reading or just relaxing playing music or listening to music but it didn't matter. I actually tried a light unit from the doctor for a few days, and it helped, but the cost was insane. A simple timer and some LEDs is a lot easier. Thanks for these threads.

1 hours later 20005849 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005803 depends on the frequency of the beat. you can use an alpha frequency to calm down before sleep. but once you are asleep you want the beat to be much slower (delta). There are tracks that run alpha at the start and then go down to delta by the time you are asleep. I personally use Neuroprogrammer 3, you can customize your tracks.

1 hours later 20005852 Anonymous
what the best position to sleep in? to feel the best

1 hours later 20005896 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005813 why did oyu only get 5h? did you stay up, or wake up earlier? or get fragmented sleep? >>20005839 learn some self-awareness. slso get yourself some red safety glasses from amazon to wear at night, you might feel a little more calm and less distracted. >>20005844 yeah i get 5050 LED with a remote and adapter from hongkong ebay for $35 or so, the timer is $10 from a hardware store.

1 hours later 20005904 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005852 Feeling is subjective. I can't tell you that. I can say that objectively most people get more SWS by sleeping on their stomachs.

1 hours later 20005956 Anonymous
Hey sleep science guy. Took your advice on the 7-11pm and 9-11am sleep cycle, been really helping a lot. A few more questions. 1. When should I be taking my melatonin? Before my sleep at night or my sleep in the morning? 2. In reference to those red glasses you recommended I wear overnight, would I wear them the whole time I'm at work, until sunrise, or from sunrise onward?

1 hours later 20005978 Anonymous
>>20005830 Thx man. Made my wife happy. Something 4chan never does.

1 hours later 20005988 Anonymous
>>20005896 The fuck do I know. I started waking up too early/in my sleep like 3 months ago. Nothing has changed in my habits, before I was able to even oversleep. The only things that changed is that I'm not a NEET anymore, I have a job now, but it's not stressful. Season change (I don't have allergies).

1 hours later 20006031 Anonymous (ThreadWins.png 340x394 9kB)
In which phase of the sleep are gains made? How long does it take to attain that phase? If that phase is disturbed (i.e: waking up for pee) How long does it take to far asleep into that phase again?

1 hours later 20006057 Anonymous
>>20005896 Something like so? http://www.amazon.com/DEWALT-DW0714 -Laser-Enhancement-Glasses/dp/B0009 3DJ4M/ref=sr_1_4?s=hi&ie=UTF8&qid=1 368768891&sr=1-4 Also self awareness such as realizing I need to go to sleep? or that my body feels tired and I should hit the sack? Thank you!

1 hours later 20006103 Sleep Science Guy
>>20005956 thats great, glad I could help :) take your melatonin before your 7pm sleep and you as long as you aren't drowsy you can take it again when you get to work at 12. Ideally you want the body to detect a 5-7h block of concentrated blood melatonin around your 'first sleep' aka the 7-11. If you are using red glasses then you wouldn't need the melatonin at 12, you would wear them while at work and take them off when you get home and go to bed. Or, really, follow your intuition, try different things out. When you take your glasses off this signals dawn to the body, so it depends whether you sleep better before or after the 'sunrise' (taking your sunnies off). I think it might be better to keep sunnies on all the way until 9am because the body produces cortisol in response to lots of light, and cortisol may mean you can't get to sleep. if this isn't a problem then just do whatever.

1 hours later 20006115 theprplehaze (1363984046102.jpg 402x686 103kB)
I have a question related to alcoholism. my cousin just got out of the marines and did a lot of drinking. a lot. he's basically a functioning alcoholic (works like a 40-50 hour week) on like 5 hours of sleep and can only fall asleep after drinking. how can i help him?

1 hours later 20006136 Anonymous
>>20006115 Look up "tapering drinking." I've done it myself a bit. I'll probably always be a drinker until I have a social life again and possibly a girlfriend. At my worst I was 2-3 handles (1.75L) a week with about a 12 pack of beers at the same time. Get him to some cognitive behavioral therapy counseling too.

1 hours later 20006166 Anonymous
>>20005610 Thanks, Sleep Bro. I'll get to work on it.

1 hours later 20006171 theprplehaze
>>20006136 cool. thanks. ill tel lhim but he has to make the choice, really.

1 hours later 20006200 Anonymous
>>20006171 If you can be more active in his life, you can help him more. It's a decision he has to make too. Try to get him away from drinking buddies he used to have if he did before the marines, and try to get him away from problem areas like bars or whatever if he drank before the marines too. Interventions don't work.

1 hours later 20006268 Sleep Science Guy
>>20006031 different hormones are released in different stages. SWS: controls growth hormone, igf1 and insulin sensitivity, this will determine fat loss. will determine your muscle gains too... REM: controls testosterone, will determine you muscle gains too. if you wake up to pee then your body has finished it's sleep stages by it's self. that means waking up to pee isn't a true sleep disturbance. >>20006057 yeha something like that, whichever blocks out light the best, there are lots of different models and prices. awareness... both. be aware of the clock time, and be aware of your body. do you feel cold? sleep time. are your eyes achey? sleep time. etc

1 hours later 20006328 Anonymous
Is it bad if I take medicine or pills to help me sleep? Things like Nyquil or sleeping pills? I have trouble falling asleep at like earlier times, so I end up going to sleep at like 2am and waking up around 1 or 3 pm the following day. Is that bad ?

1 hours later 20006339 Anonymous (1.jpg 500x639 86kB)
Does sleeping naked affect the body in anyway ?

1 hours later 20006361 Anonymous
>>20006328 >Nyquil Nyquil is fucking terrible for you. My dad abused that and Aleve and it got him horrible kidney failure. There's a certain chemical in those drugs that I believe your liver can only take a certain amount of, and then the liver is fucked. Do the research on your own, I'm a bit buzzed and can't remember the name of the drug.

1 hours later 20006402 Anonymous
>>20006103 >didn't mention I started work at 12 >a keep science guy remembers from last thread Not only are you humble and helpful, but attentive and punctual. You are a gentleman and a scholar, thankyou man

1 hours later 20006413 Anonymous
Yo sleep science guy, is it true that if I fall asleep while studying Ill actually retain more information?

1 hours later 20006430 Anonymous
>>20006268 Thank you, I'll work on fixing my sleeping.

1 hours later 20006455 Sleep Science Guy
>>20006339 being naked is advantageous because it allows the testes to lengthen or shorten appropriately, leading to better testicle/sperm health. Also if you sleep naked it is likely you sleep in a colder environment, this gives you deeper sleep. There may also be psychological advantages. >>20006328 not sleeping is going to mean you die, so using them to sleep and avoid fatal insomnia is good. otherwise they usually fuck up your sleep quality. sleeping medication is over-prescribed and people don't try proper sleeping habits before going to their doctor, and their doctor doesn't tell them to fix up their sleeping habits.

1 hours later 20006458 Anonymous
>>20006328 >Is it bad if I take medicine or pills to help me sleep? Things like Nyquil or sleeping pills? Melatonin is fine (<= 500mcg, never 1mg+ or you'll just adapt to it). Valerian root seems to be fine. If you're trying to fix your sleep schedule and get to bed early, some benadryl is probably fine for a few days. Avoid anything "harder". Just use Benadryl (antihistamine) instead of Nyquil, since that's most of what's making you actually sleepy in the Nyquil. Avoid sleeping pills since, apparently, they don't make you sleep so much as they make you forget that you spent the night tossing, turning, and *not* sleeping. Also, people do weird shit on the drugs like Ambien, like waking up a mile from home, naked.

1 hours later 20006511 Anonymous
>>20006455 I have had trouble going to sleep if I have anything important to do the next day. For example, I had a long test today, the days before this previous night I had gotten around 6.5 hours of sleep / day. I was tired as shit the night before the test, and no matter how drowsy I felt, I couldnt go to sleep for about 1.5 hours. I usually take 3 mg melatonin 30 mins before bedtime but it seemed to stop working that well (like you mentioned somewhere in the previous posts). What can I do to be able to go to sleep within 20 minutes of being in bed? I never do computer stuff within 1 hour of bedtime, I read before bedtime, I tend to avoid exercise earlier than 3 hours before bedtime. thanks.

1 hours later 20006530 Sleep Science Guy
>>20006402 heh >>20006413 only if you stayed awake and concentrated enough to learn and retain information first. studying and then sleeping straight after is one of the best learning methods. if you fall asleep only having half read shit then you won't learn anything lol. >>20006430 I find body temperature drops (sudden chills) are the best newbie indicator that their body is meant to be sleeping. I remember when I was a teenager I would just get cold, ignore it, and be cold all night until I finally fell asleep. This one is for everyone: when you go to sleep, keep the blankets to a minimum, but a heat bag on your feet is great. Warm feet helps induce sleep faster. But a cold body (as long as you are not shivering) is great for sleep quality.

1 hours later 20006585 Anonymous
2 questions: 1. it takes me ~30min-1hr to fall asleep, even if i get into bed really tired. and as soon as i start feeling tired i turn off my lights, computer, take my clothes off and then i'm wide awake again. wtf. 2. why is it that right before i wake up from a dream (usually a bad/fucking weird one) it gets very vivid, i start to hear my heartbeat and breath, and i'm always lying supine/facing the ceiling. it's usually accompanied by audio hallucinations, visual distortions and a few seconds of complete memory loss as i literally transfer from one reality (my dream) to the next. can this hinder gains? because of this, i sometimes wake up around 1-6am and fall back to sleep in 1/2 an hr. how do prevent.

1 hours later 20006618 Sleep Science Guy
>>20006458 this, melatonin is usually effective at 500mcg. Some people might need 1mg, but start low and go upward. if 1mg is doing nothing for you then keep taking it but also look elsewhere rather than upping the dose even more. he is right about many sleeping pills simply make you forget, rather than sleep better. >>20006511 if you study lots, setting up a walking desk (manual treadmill $50) can increase your daily activity, wear you out, and put you to sleep quickly. Keep your toes warm, as I said just before, and maybe try lowering your oxygen intake. You can do this when you are in bed, lying on your belly, basically purposefully breathe more shallowly and try to blank out for 5 minutes. Less oxygen = quicker sleep. After this just start thinking about previous dreams, or dreams you want to have in the future. Even just thinking about something mindless like naked girls will help some fall asleep quuickly.

1 hours later 20006634 Anonymous
>>20006530 I don't feel cold usually, I live in Florida. it's 71F out though right now, 76.7 in my room. It's much too humid to open the windows. Near my computer it's the warmest, I'm usually shirtless and have no problems ever. When you mention heat being very important, I'm wondering if I should remove my memory foam topper on my bed. It keeps a lot of my heat in, even though I sleep naked and with one blanket.

1 hours later 20006639 Anonymous
Don't surf the net before/after sleeping

1 hours later 20006650 Anonymous
>>20006585 >it's usually accompanied by audio hallucinations, visual distortions and a few seconds of complete memory loss as i literally transfer from one reality (my dream) to the next. Sounds like night terrors. I get them when I'm under stress or something. For example, my first night or two on a backpacking trip, I'll "wake up" with visual hallucinations. Or when my dickhead downstairs neighbor was doing something weird that woke me up at random intervals every night, ruining my sleep for weeks at a stretch.

1 hours later 20006692 Anonymous
>>20006618 > maybe try lowering your oxygen intake. You can do this when you are in bed, lying on your belly, basically purposefully breathe more shallowly and try to blank out for 5 minutes. Less oxygen = quicker sleep. I've noticed that I can fall asleep much easier if I lay on my left side than if I lay on my right side. I have *no* idea why, but I do recall a yoga instructor claiming that you're only supposed to roll to the right after shivasina (corpse pose, meditating on your back), supposedly due to something with your heart.

2 hours later 20006729 Anonymous
>>20006650 well, i've had them enough that i'm like "yeah whatever dreams are weird, shit happens and then we die" and they're kind of interesting. i;m ALWAYS on my back when this happens though. i also used to get quite frequent sleep paralysis and audio hallucinations while i was falling asleep. seeing stuff in the dark happens to me a bit too, even before i fall asleep. and does music help sleep at all? i used to listen to music to fall asleep but i end up getting really disoriented and confused while falling asleep/waking up. it helps all the weirdness of falling asleep go away though.

2 hours later 20006736 Anonymous
A lot of people have said it but it bears repeating: don't go on your computer or watch tv before bed if you are having trouble going to sleep. The light and stimulation screws with your sleep cycle. Read a book. f.lux is a good program that shifts the color spectrum of the monitor from blue to red as day turns to night if you need/want to be on.

2 hours later 20006760 Anonymous (Jeff Seid tries to choose between two delicious looking dudes.gif 400x386 1766kB)
>Get Tdap shot yesterday >Get horrible flu-like symptoms from it, arm in horrible pain from shot >Try to go to sleep to escape the pain >Have horrible depressing dream that was depressing for no reason, wake up with crushing headache like 5 times >Finally get up at 4 pm >Wake up still depressed >Still in pain >But don't wanna go back to bed to depressing places

2 hours later 20006810 Anonymous (writer_writers_people_writing_high_resolution_desk.jpg 1290x810 237kB)
---seriously need help here---- i have narcolepsy. i constantly wake up throughout the night. i get ZERO deep sleep. i have an app that measures movement, i literally never dip into deep sleep. im partially conscious most of the night, im exhausted literally all day. barely able to stay awake. when i nap, im out for hours, and wake up super sleepy. its just bad. ive been this way my whole life. i know i have narcolepsy due to a sleep study i did a while back. is there ANYTHING i can do? i want to feel normal. i want to wake up feeling refreshed like a normal person. i wake up DEAD tired every single day. i feel like i havent slept in years help

2 hours later 20006816 Sleep Science Guy
>>20006585 sounds like you are transitioning from a dream and into sleep paralysis before waking up. You can't really help this unless you can somehow stop yourself from rolling onto your back while you sleep. or it could be night terrors. >>20006692 lying on your left side is actually an advantage related to your digestive system. Sleeping on your left means food more easily passes from your stomach into your intestine, it is just a human instinct, even if you haven't eaten.

2 hours later 20006897 Anonymous
>>20006729 > i;m ALWAYS on my back when this happens though. Same for me, pretty much. Either laying on my back, or it's also happened when I took a nap in my car with the seat leaned back as far as it would go (which really wasn't very far back). That time, I woke up and felt that it was stifling hot and that I was suffocating, and the only way I could make myself breathe was to focus all of my attention on it.

2 hours later 20006898 Anonymous

2 hours later 20006914 Anonymous
>>20006816 i know that the end of my dreams are sometimes scary, but i couldn't be too sure if they are night terrors because the dreams are so much better than reality, i want to go back to them sometimes when i wake up. they're so surreal, magical and perfect. then all of a sudden i see a ghost, i realize that i'm in a dream, i die, i get a boner, etc. and i wake up in this weird psychedelic state where i dont feel human, but rather just purely conscious. weeeirrrd stuff. i gotta say though, i have some dreams where i would give everything i have to go back to them, they were just that perfect.

2 hours later 20006922 Anonymous
>>20006810 Have you tried taking Modafinil/Provigil/Armodafinil/Nuvi gil during the day?

2 hours later 20006962 Anonymous
>>20006922 >>20006922 ive tried mondafinil and provigil. its been a few years, but dont remember them having any effect (or i would have continued to use one of them)

2 hours later 20006976 Sleep Science Guy
>>20006692 also, yoga instructor giving medical advice? hah! what she is talking about comes from chinese or indian alternative medicine (read: pseudo-science crap)... it is like when they talk about the liver being active at 12am or something, they are just making things up. there is no evidence it works like that. >>20006810 sucks to be you. try all the things i listed here >>20005610 otherwise you might like to try modafinil to stay awake with your narcolepsy, and something to stop movement at night. If you want to go the experimental route, you could buy a TDCS machine and reduce your motor cortex activity before and during your sleep. if you have a doctor then ask him about iron deficiency, and thyroid problems, which can be a secondary cause...they might put you on gabapentin or clona, but you could try something like valarian root, htp5 or things like that beforehand.

2 hours later 20007045 Sleep Science Guy
>>20006914 well, doesn't sound like it effects you in a bad way, just enjoy it! many people try to practice lucid dreaming to get an experience similar to yours, and they cant. >>20006897 sleep paralysis. you can't actually suffocate hehe, but I do know your brain can do some pretty fucked up things.

2 hours later 20007076 Anonymous
>>20004925 how can i into more sex dreams?

2 hours later 20007094 Anonymous
Need 3 more for archive. Thanks again, Sleep Science Guy.

2 hours later 20007185 Anonymous
>>20007076 pls respond

2 hours later 20007212 Sleep Science Guy
>>20007076 lucid dreaming. start a dream journal, start doing WBTB and reality checks. google these terms if oyu don't know them. also stop fapping for a while. you will get some sexual tension build up. sex dreams are a common side effect of starting nofap.

2 hours later 20007219 Anonymous
>>20007045 the only few times i've had actual lucid dreams, they were a shitload of fuck. they made no sense, i had no control over the set/setting and overall i couldn't even begin to describe them haha. every time i dream its like a movie, scary or romantic, that i have to sit through. ever since i started doing psychedelics though, i noticed that you cant't (or atleast I can't) see dreams. they're not visual for me. instead they become mental images that get so concentrated that they take over all of my senses. ever since i started to have psychedelic experiences everything is suddenly stereotypical, paradoxical, oxymoronic, (not a real word i think) yet normal. it's always been this way, but you never actually saw these details. anyways i gotta sleep for my gains. thanks OP.

2 hours later 20007299 Anonymous
>>20007212 3inception5me

2 hours later 20007308 Anonymous
I got super into lucid dreaming a few years ago. spent 2 1/2 years keeping a dream journal, using every method I could possibly find and only had like ~5 lucid dreams over that entire period the only thing I didn't try was supplements so now I'm interested in finding some good stuff to take before bed. heard people talking about a pre workout called craze giving them crazy dreams, and all of my previous lucid dreams came about because the content of the dream was absurd and I realized it so, what stuff gives you crazy dreams

2 hours later 20007364 Anonymous
>>20007308 fish oil, zma, and benadryl. Craze may give you crazy dreams, but you can't take it anywehre near bedtime...for obvious reasons...

2 hours later 20007450 Anonymous
>>20007364 thanks, I hadn't heard of fish oil having an effect on dreams before and I always take it really early in the morning. will def try that one out tonight

2 hours later 20007454 Sleep Science Guy
>>20007308 I am not sure what is in craze, but I assume it is a stimulant. YOu can get the same effect by drinking half a coffee before falling asleep quickly. Obviously this is bad because it reduces sleep quality, in fact this is why you get crazy dreams. In the second half of the night when the stimulants wear off you get a sleep rebound (REM rebound, specifically) and so instead of having fragmented dreams every few hours thourhgout the night, you get one really long crazy dream. It won't be very restorative in the long run. You are better looking elseware. I said in an earlier post, get some good deep sleep in the first half of the night then wake up. Stay up for a few hours then take high doses choline alteration drugs like 2g citicoline, 400mcg huperzine, etc and some relaxants like 400mg magnesium, then get yourself ready in the sleep paralysis position (supine, on your back). Go to sleep and perhaps try FILD.

2 hours later 20007468 Sleep Science Guy
>>20007450 fish oil will give you general brain health, but no direct effect on dream intensity.

2 hours later 20007473 Anonymous
>>20007308 Calea Zacatechichi The craziest story I heard about it was a guy saying he lived for 70 years inside his dream, and even if that story is bullshit everything else I've heard makes it sound great.

2 hours later 20007476 Anonymous
>>20005266 If I do not have a reason to wake up then I will naturally sleep for 10+ hours and do not feel tired. Now when I hit the 17-18 hour mark I feel a bit tired but I can power through it and feel rested again. >bitches dont know about my sleep

2 hours later 20007527 Anonymous
>>20007454 dang looks like a trip to the supplement store is in order for that stuff. thanks for the detailed advice, really motivated now to get back into lucid dreaming now

2 hours later 20007570 Anonymous
how much sleep do I really need? I'm a college senior on the rugby team, and I have a job. 8 hours a night is just not possible.

2 hours later 20007601 Anonymous
>>20007570 http://www.bulletproofexec.com/impr ove-your-sleep/

3 hours later 20007647 Anonymous (1356863280054.jpg 1000x770 170kB)
How come if I go to bed earlier than usual by a few hours, I'll wake up exactly 6 hours and 10 minutes later unable to sleep?

3 hours later 20007657 Anonymous
So everytime i get into a good sleeping pattern, bed 9-10PM wake up 6-8AM i grow out of it in about 2 weeks and go back to sleeping at 5am and waking up 4PM. this shit sucks. Also i can never wake up unless ive slept at least 10 hours, what do

3 hours later 20007712 Anonymous
Sleep Science Guy, when are my darkcircles supposed to leave ? I sleep well, eat well, wake up when I want.

3 hours later 20007720 Anonymous
>>20005988 Thoughts?

3 hours later 20007723 Sleep Science Guy
>>20007527 oh I warn you about magnesium, only ever get chelated magnesium, the other types (oxide or citrate or whatever) act as laxatives so are therefore not suitable for before sleep. When you are sleeping your gut tries shuts down so if you have mag citrate making it squiggle around it will disturb your sleep.

3 hours later 20007752 Anonymous
>>20007723 What is the best type of magnesium ?

3 hours later 20007774 Anonymous
>>20007752 nvm didn't see chelated magnesium.

3 hours later 20007790 Anonymous
>>20007723 ive got magnesium asparate and it doesn't give me those effects, granted I'm only taking ~80mg in the morning and 450mg at night.

3 hours later 20007818 Anonymous
>>20007723 buttcrisis averted, chelated magnesium it is

3 hours later 20007824 Anonymous
>>20004925 OP, I find myself being conscious in my dreams sometimes, however, I cannot quite figure out how to change the dream whilst I'm in it... So what should I do when I realise I'm in a dream, to alter the subject of the dream I'm in, I've tried thinking think about people, trying to bring them into the dream but nothing seems to happen...

3 hours later 20007867 Sleep Science Guy
>>20007712 everyone has this question, i don't know the answer. many docs will claim it is genetic, but I think there is more to it than that. While many people say they get adequate sleep, they may not be getting enough SWS... and they simply don't notice it. SWS is the hardest stage of sleep to improve, but I have talked about it twice in this thread now. I notice that when I regularly take a midday nap it goes away a lot. I think taking a midday nap gives you midday REM, which reduces REM pressure for the dusk sleep, this results in less early-night REM and more early-night SWS. Improving the pigment of your skin with high intakes of lycopene, carotene, astaxanthin, etc and adequate fat can help. And of course allergies and vitamin deficiencies may make it worse. Anyway none of this is new or helpful, but you can try address any problems you have none the less.

3 hours later 20007908 Anonymous
get this archived so i can read it later when im not half asleep chanarchive org/request_votes

3 hours later 20007920 Sleep Science Guy
>>20007790 some people will be more susceptible than others. >>20007824 get more control with perception enforcing actions... clapping your hands, spinning in circles to get a better view of the dreamscape... and trying to touch/feel, see, taste things around you. it will make the dream really vivid, and then you can start to focus on your own flow of thoughts. Distinguish a difference between you and your dream... then BE your ego. Be confident in your control over the dream. It is your dream! etc...

3 hours later 20007925 Anonymous
>>20007908 Leave it open in a tab m8. You're not worth the effort.

3 hours later 20007939 Anonymous (400690_152249421616763_1938390548_n.jpg 960x639 85kB)
>>20004925 no questions, just thanks for your time. i'll be trying out lots of your suggestions.

3 hours later 20008034 Sleep Science Guy
>>20007867 while westerners don't often suffer from vitamin deficiency, many people will ahve a low intake of these nutrients: melatonin vitamin d retinol iodine magnesium potassium fibre (soluble) together aiming to get these in your diet can help improve liver and thyroid function, and give you better quality sleep, as well as reabsorb cholesterol/toxins etc. Allergies, tbh, are best delt with through controlled exposure. Of course do this with medical supervision. And with a midday nap you might be able to get rid of your baggy eyes.

3 hours later 20008059 Anonymous
Is there such a thing as baggy eyes that wont go away no matter how much you sleep?

3 hours later 20008110 Anonymous
>>20008034 hey sleep science guy, no questions this time but a suggestion, you should make a general f.a.q that you could post everytime you start a thread, answering the very basic questions, like why do we need to sleep etc, keep up the good work, lots of informative stuff here

3 hours later 20008126 Anonymous
how do you feel about alarm clocks? is it better for you to naturally wake out of your sleep?

3 hours later 20008178 Sleep Science Guy
>>20008059 yes, if you are getting adequate SWS and REM and still have baggy eyes then it is being caused by something secondary like i talked about above. if nothing works, it may be genetic. I just doubt that it is genetic for most people, just as I doubt obesity is genetic for most people. Epigenetic? Yes, sure, but that means you can change it over time wiht the right stimulus. >>20008110 I am working on one right now. Will post it up next week, I will let someone else turn it into a pretty infograph.

3 hours later 20008219 Sleep Science Guy
>>20008126 I like light-alarms better. sound doesn't produce any meaninful hormonal reponse... adrenaline of course works to wake you up, but that means you need to be surprised awake. light is a much better alarm because your body produces cortisol in response to it in adequate amounts. thus I prescribe people LED+timer or a sunrise simulator to turn on 30 mins before you want to get up. you can then use a sound alarm after the 'sun has risen' and it will actually work.

3 hours later 20008232 Sleep Science Guy
>>20008126 so yes, it is better to naturally wake up. I use a sunrise simulator i rigged up at home, and i wake up by myself without any sound based alarm. Big improvement compared to when I relied on my alarmclock years ago.

3 hours later 20008245 Sleep Science Guy
and of course you can just leave your window open and wake up with the real sunrise, but this is not an option for many people.

3 hours later 20008386 Anonymous
Sleep is the only thing I look forward to every day. How can I feel like I feel when I'm asleep?

4 hours later 20008638 Anonymous
Hey SSG, How do you feel about biphasic/polyphasic sleep schedules? Will having a 4.5 hour core sleep and 1.5 nap put my gains in danger?

4 hours later 20008668 Anonymous
is there anything i can do about my tinnitus? its really bad and keeps me up

4 hours later 20008815 Sleep Science Guy
>>20008638 While having a 1.5h nap is great, it entirely depends on your SWS/REM. If you want to do polyphasic sleep get something like a Zeo and record how much you get normally, then change your sleep and see how much you are getting then. You might get more mileage out of 3 sleeps a day... 3-4h at dusk, then 1.5h at dawn, then 20 minutes at lunch. Again it really depends how much REM/SWS you are getting.

4 hours later 20008882 Sleep Science Guy
>>20008815 maybe more realistic is 3-4h dusk, 2-3h dawn and 20 min lunch.

4 hours later 20008921 Anonymous
>>20008815 I have a professor who does sleep studies and studies sleep spindles and such, pretty cool stuff. Like many people though I don't get enough sleep I could stay up until 9 am and sleep until 5 pm or maybe only get 2 hours of sleep or none at all on a constant basis. I'm 21 and it's been going on for maybe 6 years now? It's mainly because of the magic light of my computer screen, I feel relaxed because of it but never sleepy. Since then BP has been high as shit and I'm worried I'm just ruining my sleep cycles and body in general. How fucked is my circadian rhythm & what do you recommend I do in terms of regulating the light that plagues my sleep from this monitor? Also, how long does it take to get back into proper circadian rhythm (if I remember it was around a month?) and in terms of cortisol levels how can that be messing with my body / blood pressure. Thanks for the help.

4 hours later 20008949 Anonymous
>>20008921 Also what research have you done and what are you currently researching?

4 hours later 20008963 Anonymous
What do you think about 25-30min nap after lunch?

4 hours later 20008969 Anonymous
Does morning wood have anything to do with testosterone levels?

4 hours later 20009049 Anonymous
>>20008882 Thanks good sir, I wonder though if I should just return to a monophasic schedule.

5 hours later 20009117 Sleep Science Guy
>>20008921 If the computer screen is the only light you are exposed to at night, get a sheet of rubylith from ebay or something and cover your screen with it, like I did in the OP. I use sticky buttons to put it on at night and take it off during the day. Not having enough melatonin in your body make it more prone to oxidative stress, and for some people a non-24h body clock. Melatonin deficiency can also manifest as poor sleep quality, I remember reading a study where geriatrics given melatonin got improved SWS. Most systems will fix up in a week of consistent schedule, but as with many bodily adaptations 4-6 weeks is what it takes for a full adaptation, namely the ones non-related to sleep, but still linked to the SCN. Blood pressure and core temperature can be controlled with melatonin... and progesterone, testosterone, can be controlled by sleep. i am more talking about thyroid function.

5 hours later 20009212 Sleep Science Guy
>>20008949 currently just working in a sleep lab. dat's where da money is at for me. I would love to do research in the future though, and I read papers in my spare time sometimes. >>20008963 Studies have shown a 10-20min nap is better than 25-30. 10 min naps show best immediate improvements in reaction time, concentration and memory, but 20 min naps show a longer improvement. If you sleep for 25-30 you tend to get sleep inertia because the body starts to get ready for deeper sleep and sleep for a whole 90 minute cycle. >>20008969 yes, you certainly need testosterone to get a boner, morning wood is both to do with secondary bodily functions which support REM via body paralysis as well as testosterone acting on penile nerves. >>20009049 I have done biphasic sleep and triphasic.. i settled on the triphasic schedule i described to you and still do it currently.

5 hours later 20009277 Sleep Science Guy
well I am out for the night, have good sleep /fit/

5 hours later 20009408 Anonymous
>>20009212 Not sure if I have the time to take a nap in the middle of the day SSG, is biphasic worth trying? When do you recommend i sleep, and how do i get into it? Thank you based sleep guru

6 hours later 20010031 Anonymous
not really a question, but something cool that happend to me a couple of weeks ago. ive heard about lucid dreaming for years, but never got to experience it myself untill this one dream. I was walking around at a party, just walking by all the people there, just chilling. Suddenly i saw a mirror and as i was watching my reflection of me with my long, curly hair i remembered, i cut my hair short a year ago. i then knew that i must be dreaming and in the rest of the dream i could control what happend. spent the dream being alpha, fingering like 10 different girls. srs. it was a good night alone.

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